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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 14:27:28 GMT -6
l three public commenters were very much against the split, but not solidly against Bonine.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 14:29:12 GMT -6
I missed a post. At the conclusion of the break, the committee went into executive session.
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Post by Griffinfan on Jul 25, 2016 14:49:24 GMT -6
You know, I'm also pissed at the public side. Actually, I'm pissed at every principal, AD, and coach who went down and cast a vote! Why?? A split was quickly voted in two years ago . All I heard from the pro split side was that they were going to fix problems with the system. Instead, what did they do? Voted to expand the split to more sports! That's not fixing the problem!!! Now, we have all of these state champs, 0-10 teams making the playoffs and NOTHING IS BEING DONE!!! I'm for a split but all y'all have done is make this wonderful State with the best athletes in the country LOOK DAMN STUPID!! I will never spend another dime to go see a high school sport in our state until y'all get get off your fat butts and get to work on this problem!! Y'all are a laughingstock!!!!
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Post by Griffinfan on Jul 25, 2016 14:51:39 GMT -6
I'm sorry I hijacked your thread kbanes. You're doing a wonderful job!! Thank you!
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Post by Griffinfan on Jul 25, 2016 14:57:52 GMT -6
Just read on Twitter, out of a possible 1440 playoff berths, 664 of them will be byes and teams with losing records. FIX IT, STUPID!!!
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:07:46 GMT -6
Griffinfan, no sweat. I titled this an open thread. All comments welcome.
They are still in executive session, anyway. Might be a while.
But about those numbers on playoff berths, while those numbers seem a little high, I agree that it is a problem and should be addressed. I don't have a problem with byes, as that is just a function of a bracket.
I could see the sense of only allowing 16 team brackets. This would fix both the byes and losing team making the playoffs.
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Post by indy on Jul 25, 2016 15:21:18 GMT -6
How about isolating the problem and fix it. If the problem is zones, then fix it. If it recruiting then fix it. The split fixed nothing, it actually made things worse. You can't put a bandaid on a grenade wound.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:31:53 GMT -6
I don't think that anything will be done to change the split. Short of changing voting rules, I think that the split will always win an up or down vote.
I don't see any way to alleviate the concerns of a majority, that would be acceptable to the minority. How do you do away with a (perceived or real) advantage? I just don't think that selects would ever accept any kind of limit on their attendance zones, which I think is the only thing that would make non-selects happy.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:32:27 GMT -6
And, still in executive session.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:34:55 GMT -6
They have been in there a while. I thought they went into executive session to address a specific question, but after an hour, it might be the fight over firing Bonine.
Looks like they are coming back into regular session.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:36:12 GMT -6
Bonine did not return from the executive session
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:37:12 GMT -6
The meeting has been adjourned with no explanation.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:38:31 GMT -6
Bonine just walked in after the adjournement.
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Post by indy on Jul 25, 2016 15:39:18 GMT -6
The meeting has been adjourned with no explanation. Well, thanks anyway for waiting and wasting half a day. We all appreciate your effort.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:40:56 GMT -6
Wen questioned by reporters, Bonnaffee stated that Bonine IS the executive director
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:45:42 GMT -6
When interviewed, Bonine explained that he has to move forward and identify the steps required to move the LHSAA forward. When asked, he said that he feels that he has the full support of the Executive committee.
This was a very strange ending to the days proceedings. I get the feeling that Bonine took a beating in the executive session, but that there wasn't support to get rid of him. We may never know.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:49:28 GMT -6
I have a feeling that the split and Bonine are here to stay. The LHSAA is going to concentrate on increasing communication between the LHSAA and the Executive committee. There is going to also need to be better communication with the principals, but my feeling is that any "palace intrigue" centers around the principals.
I expect Bonine to gointo a "take no prisoners" mode.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 25, 2016 15:50:15 GMT -6
I'm done here. If anyone has specific questions, post them and I will reply later thisevening.
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Post by indy on Jul 25, 2016 15:53:52 GMT -6
I have a feeling that the split and Bonine are here to stay. The LHSAA is going to concentrate on increasing communication between the LHSAA and the Executive committee. There is going to also need to be better communication with the principals, but my feeling is that any "palace intrigue" centers around the principals. I expect Bonine to gointo a "take no prisoners" mode. I wonder how he will handle legal actions and potential exits from the private schools? Poor fellow!
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Post by publicgradprivatedad on Jul 25, 2016 15:54:30 GMT -6
I'm done here. If anyone has specific questions, post them and I will reply later thisevening. Thanks for the great reporting.
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Post by Raven on Jul 25, 2016 15:57:24 GMT -6
I'm done here. If anyone has specific questions, post them and I will reply later thisevening. Just wanted to say nice job on keeping everyone informed. I appreciate it. Definitely interesting times for the association.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2016 16:00:19 GMT -6
Whew! Thought I was going to have to change my handle.
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Post by indy on Jul 25, 2016 17:27:47 GMT -6
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Post by iknownuthing on Jul 25, 2016 21:32:16 GMT -6
I think the executive meet took so long because it probably went something like this: Several public principals on the committee demanded either his resignation of he would be fired. Mr Bonine rose and spoke to them saying: Gentlemen and ladies of the board and I use that term loosely. You hired me to correct a situation that cannot be corrected. You violate your own constitution and bylaws and then expect someone to come in and correct it. Then you pull the rug out from under me when I seek to legally put an end to the nonsense and un-constitutional vote by having a revote which ends up and an expansion of the split. Now you once again are seeking to violate your own by-laws by firing me. The terms of my contract are specific and if you try to fire me or ruin my reputation with any more slander or innuendo I will seek all legal recourse to hold the LHSAA and each principal on this committee personally and legally liable for their abusive and intrusive activities and actions. While I regret my statement, not because I made it but because it was leaked by someone attempting to sabotage my tenure. If it is proven that the leak came from someone on this committee who are the only other individuals with access to that report I shall seek triple damages. You have collectively, particularly the north Louisiana principals on the committee sabotage the good of the organization for your own personal gain. You are morally and ethically bankrupt. If you continue on this track I will also report to the IRS that you are in violation of several of the requirements as an organization to remain a non profit and have been in violation for over 5 years. You will be forced to pay back taxes and penalties and you membership will bear the brunt of the cost. So it is your choice gentleman and ladies, shall we dance to the court house or will you seek true reconciliation? The choice is yours. At this point, the lawyer in the room asked to which tenants was he speaking? He told him and after about 1/2 hour of head scratching, the lawyer told them to capitulate for the time being because there was a real danger in what he stated. LOL. only in OZ.
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Post by indy on Jul 26, 2016 6:46:24 GMT -6
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Post by kbanes on Jul 26, 2016 7:04:00 GMT -6
Well, Iknownuthing, I wouldn't go quite that far. I was in total agreement right up to the accusation that the North Louisiana Principals are sabotaging the association for personal gain. I'm not sure what you mean by personal gain. Normally that means money, and I just don't see that.
I also doubt that he had to rant about IRS violations. Bonine mentioned an IRS audit and penalties paid in his opening statement, so he couldn't really hold that over their heads. I seem to remember in the order of $250,000. But he went by it so fast, I almost missed it.
If I had to guess, I would say that the Finance Committee chairman told them that they only had $3000 dollars in the bank (as reported by Bonine) and there wasn't enough money to buy him out. Then the lawyer told them that there was no legal reason to fire him. Someone misappropriated his memo to NHSF (and I think that Bonine suspects someone on the Executive Committee). At that point, the argument is, did the memo contain any libelous or untrue information? Is there anyone here that DOESN"T think that the situation is a dumpster fire? I'm pretty sure that the lawyer told them that you have no grounds for dismissal, and that, not only do you not have the money to pay him off if you lose, you don't even have the money to pay the lawyers to go to trial.
Bonine acted like he had all of the winning cards in his hand. As he was going through his statement, I thought that he was giving them the finger by leaving. Now, I think that he was actually giving them the finger by staying. While the split has certainly festered, he has addressed and disposed of several large problem that existed before he took the job, problems that he didn't know about when he took the job.
I don't think that you should undersell the point that Bonnaffee appears to be totally in the Bonine camp. I have a strong suspicion that the entire LHSAA staff is, also.
At the Bonine hiring interview, the people that were on the hiring committee knew that the LHSAA was being run like a mom and pop organization. They said as much to Bonine in the interview, and he was told to try raise the standards in the area of procedures and standards. This is how some of the discovery of the Officials problem and the unconstitutional passage of the first split came about. These were discovered while trying to revise existing procedures.
Nope, if a fired Bonine had taken the LHSAA to court, I'm pretty sure that the LHSAA would have wound up bankrupt.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 26, 2016 7:19:56 GMT -6
Another point that I would like to make is that Bonine, on a couple of instances, made note of the fact that the vote split, while passing at 53% to 47% (I think) was somewhat misleading because the total student population of the schools voting for the split was approximately 45,000, while the population of those voting against the split were approximately 48,000. He also mentioned the fallacy of have non-football schools vote on football related issues, non-baseball schools voting on baseball related issues, etc.
During the discussion after the Bonine statement, one committee member from a smaller classification school (I think she said that she was from a class C school) wanted to know if Bonine mentioning this was an indication that there was going to be effort made to change the voting procedures during annual conventions. She never really got an answer to her question, that I could tell.
It is something that clearly ticks Bonine off.
I bring this up, because I'm wondering if what we saw yesterday was a dramatic change in the power structure of the LHSAA. Bonine (with help) stared down the Committee and won. I wonder if revised voting procedures might be the first thing that he tries that will enable him to kill off the split? That might be his best option. And he mentioned it for a reason.
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Post by iknownuthing on Jul 26, 2016 7:43:42 GMT -6
Another point that I would like to make is that Bonine, on a couple of instances, made note of the fact that the vote split, while passing at 53% to 47% (I think) was somewhat misleading because the total student population of the schools voting for the split was approximately 45,000, while the population of those voting against the split were approximately 48,000. He also mentioned the fallacy of have non-football schools vote on football related issues, non-baseball schools voting on baseball related issues, etc. During the discussion after the Bonine statement, one committee member from a smaller classification school (I think she said that she was from a class C school) wanted to know if Bonine mentioning this was an indication that there was going to be effort made to change the voting procedures during annual conventions. She never really got an answer to her question, that I could tell. It is something that clearly ticks Bonine off. I bring this up, because I'm wondering if what we saw yesterday was a dramatic change in the power structure of the LHSAA. Bonine (with help) stared down the Committee and won. I wonder if revised voting procedures might be the first thing that he tries that will enable him to kill off the split? That might be his best option. And he mentioned it for a reason. My rant was somewhat tongue in cheek. If he tries to change how the voting is done, he will fail. To get the vote changed to either by student population, or by sport participation he would have to get the total majority to approve by simple majority. The pro-split people will band together again and stop any changes made. They will NEVER vote to have less control. the only possibility would be to do it in increments, first getting a separation by class, then by sport and them move to combine. I just don't think he has that much time left before the private schools ultimately bolt. Good thing is that due to the lateness of this process, he has a about 8 months to get something done.
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Post by kbanes on Jul 26, 2016 8:41:09 GMT -6
I don't know. I just don't have the data required to get some idea where these kinds of votes would fall out. An interest note, while getting headcounts prior to the vote for/against the split, Bonine talked to 56 public Principals that indicated that they were against the split, and 51 of them wound up voting in favor of it. I thought that was interesting.
I just see a real possibility that Bonine starts to play hardball with the "northern Principals". He is never going to have as much power has he has right now (unless he breaks the back of the split supporters).
I think the battle is going to be fought in the Executive Committee over which proposals actually get put on the Agenda for the Annual Convention. If Bonine can maneuver that, there might be a path. It might take a couple of years, done incrementally, but I think that it is proven beyond doubt that a split will never lose with the existing voting procedures and existing principals in place. You can't change the principals, so...
I still don't understand why an "Indiana Solution" wasn't put before the convention last time.
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Post by Rick James on Jul 26, 2016 9:17:20 GMT -6
Banes,
I honestly think you are misreading the outcome of yesterday if you believe Mr Bonine has the most power he will ever have this morning.
He is now basically an overpaid administrative assistant for the executive committee.
Listen to the interview on 104.5 this morning and I think you will understand. Totally hat in hand.
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