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Post by gentlemanjack on Apr 15, 2016 6:12:56 GMT -6
I've been to ND's football stadium and that's not what I would call rural by any stretch. My question is this : what happens when a metro area expands and a school that might once have been outside the 9.5 miles (or whatever it is) now is inside ? Do they switch from rural to metro? I think about North Desoto. I think I heard they would be classified rural. They are roughly 10 miles from Shreveport city limits. They are in a booming area. Pretty soon it'll probably all run together from SW Shreveport to Stonewall. That doesn't sound very rural to me. Lots of people move there to send their kids to school there. That shouldn't be classified as rural. First off the stadium ND uses is not their's but is granted the use of by the Acadia Parish School System. Secondly, ND lies 20 miles west as the crow flies from Lafayette, 50 from Lake Charles and even greater lengths to Alexandria, so I am not sure using mileage as the basis what you would consider rural. Lastly, what is decided today regarding the parameters can be reset at later dates as the need so arises.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 7:28:35 GMT -6
This is not now, nor ever has been about a "split". Its about HOW we are split. Urban/Rural is a split..........but why such the warm reception for it??? The warm reception was obviously in your own mind. I will say it again for you since you didn't comprehend the first time. The people who are against the split are still against the split. Nothing has changed. The people for the split are still for it. Nothing has changed there either. 4A and 5A schools wanted to end the split. The LHSAA risked losing many of biggest schools to a new association. They come back together. 2A schools still want a split. There will still be a split, just a different kind of split. And yes, it's called compromise. No one is happy, but it's something we can live with until a better solution comes along. i dont recall any of my 4a 5a people wanting to end the split. Maybe where your from
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 7:32:35 GMT -6
The warm reception was obviously in your own mind. I will say it again for you since you didn't comprehend the first time. The people who are against the split are still against the split. Nothing has changed. The people for the split are still for it. Nothing has changed there either. 4A and 5A schools wanted to end the split. The LHSAA risked losing many of biggest schools to a new association. They come back together. 2A schools still want a split. There will still be a split, just a different kind of split. And yes, it's called compromise. No one is happy, but it's something we can live with until a better solution comes along. i dont recall any of my 4a 5a people wanting to end the split. Maybe where your from yes, most definitely in the BR and NOLA areas.
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 7:42:45 GMT -6
I agree Notre Dame has not always be a powerhouse, but this would set them up to be one. So we would go from Mr. Booker's plan, that people suggested benefited his program, to Coach Cook's plan that people believe benefit his program. Do not think this will bring people back together, just moves the shoe to the other foot. You're right. This doesn't bring us back together. It's a step though. Not for the lower classes, but for at least for 4A and 5A. If it passes, and the big privates are happy again, there will be no chance of a separate association. That at least keeps the smaller private schools in the LHSAA long enough to find a better solution.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 7:46:57 GMT -6
I repeat, we will never "go back together", not like it was. Apples and Oranges. The non select schools will never again put themselves at such a competitive disadvantage JUST to appease schools/parents that choose to send their kids elsewhere. That ship has sailed
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 8:28:28 GMT -6
I repeat, we will never "go back together", not like it was. Apples and Oranges. The non select schools will never again put themselves at such a competitive disadvantage JUST to appease schools/parents that choose to send their kids elsewhere. That ship has sailed Keep banging that drum, bob. Maybe someone will eventually believe you.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 8:32:19 GMT -6
I repeat, we will never "go back together", not like it was. Apples and Oranges. The non select schools will never again put themselves at such a competitive disadvantage JUST to appease schools/parents that choose to send their kids elsewhere. That ship has sailed Keep banging that drum, bob. Maybe someone will eventually believe you. No drum my man, but apparently the majority "believes me" now. Hence, the "split" as coined by the naysayers. (Actually just another way of classification)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 8:32:28 GMT -6
I repeat, we will never "go back together", not like it was. Apples and Oranges. The non select schools will never again put themselves at such a competitive disadvantage JUST to appease schools/parents that choose to send their kids elsewhere. That ship has sailed Of course not, no one I know believes we will ever go back. Might be some tweaks, but we're not going back like it was.
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 9:19:37 GMT -6
Keep banging that drum, bob. Maybe someone will eventually believe you. No drum my man, but apparently the majority "believes me" now. Hence, the "split" as coined by the naysayers. (Actually just another way of classification) Your lack of understanding is truly impressive. If it was simply a different way to classify schools, then there would be separate classifications based on select/non select enrollment. That does not exist. There are still only 5 classes for football. So no, it is not simply just another way to classify schools. It's all about the trophies, boys. And that's that.
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 9:23:35 GMT -6
I repeat, we will never "go back together", not like it was. Apples and Oranges. The non select schools will never again put themselves at such a competitive disadvantage JUST to appease schools/parents that choose to send their kids elsewhere. That ship has sailed Of course not, no one I know believes we will ever go back. Might be some tweaks, but we're not going back like it was. I didn't say it would go back to how it was before. I fully agree there should be a method put in place to adjust a school's enrollment numbers up or down to put them in classifications with other schools that they are better able to compete with. However, there is no reason we can't go back to 5 football classes with ALL teams eligible to make the playoffs in their respective class.
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Post by btown on Apr 15, 2016 9:37:15 GMT -6
Of course not, no one I know believes we will ever go back. Might be some tweaks, but we're not going back like it was. I didn't say it would go back to how it was before. I fully agree there should be a method put in place to adjust a school's enrollment numbers up or down to put them in classifications with other schools that they are better able to compete with. However, there is no reason we can't go back to 5 football classes with ALL teams eligible to make the playoffs in their respective class. You might not see a reason why we can't go back to 5 football classes in the playoffs, but the principals do. As long as different groups keep trying to force the issue it will never happen. The principals keep getting backed into a corner, by Bonine or the Legislators, and they do not like. If everyone would leave it alone the principals could work towards improving the system, but have never been given a chance. Would the system get better over night, no.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 10:01:58 GMT -6
The Principals are the group that voted in the split. WE WILL NEVER GO BACK TO THE OLD WAY OF THINKING.
Now, keep this in mind.....What guarantees does the LHSAA have that should this new "plan" be voted in, there STILL wont be Legislative intervention? (not that I think Talbot has the support, because he doesnt)
I have found that the simplest answer is the usually the best...........and here it is.
Talbot represents the John Curtis School area. I assume probably most or at least some of the Catholic schools in NOLA also. With this in mind, this "new plan" has been proposed that effectively puts 4A and 5A back together. This allows more playoff teams and more teams for the Catholic Schools (and Curtis) to play. That has been those schools concern, and only concern, from the get.....and rightfully so.
With that in mind, all this rhetoric over and over about "For the good of the Association" is a bunch of crap. EVERY school is out for whats best for THEIR SCHOOL! If not, why would Talbot back off with his threats (which wont happen) if only 4A and 5A is reunited?
Men, you cant have it both ways. You cant say "All for one and one for all" and then turn right around and say, "well, for us and not for yall"
Talbot is a minor, VERY minor player in the state legislature. His weakness is, and was, exposed yesterday and in the general sessions. Plus, the Governor will NEVER sign such craziness. The ONLY thing that is gonna come out of all of this is no matter what is or is not approved is;
1) Bonine will lose his job 2) Everyone will still play football on friday nights, just like the last 3 years.
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 10:17:43 GMT -6
The Principals are the group that voted in the split. WE WILL NEVER GO BACK TO THE OLD WAY OF THINKING. And no one is suggesting that. That's only in your own mind. But by all means keep using that caps lock button. It's truly intimidating.
Now, keep this in mind.....What guarantees does the LHSAA have that should this new "plan" be voted in, there STILL wont be Legislative intervention? (not that I think Talbot has the support, because he doesnt) I have found that the simplest answer is the usually the best...........and here it is. Talbot represents the John Curtis School area. I assume probably most or at least some of the Catholic schools in NOLA also. With this in mind, this "new plan" has been proposed that effectively puts 4A and 5A back together. This allows more playoff teams and more teams for the Catholic Schools (and Curtis) to play. That has been those schools concern, and only concern, from the get.....and rightfully so. With that in mind, all this rhetoric over and over about "For the good of the Association" is a bunch of crap. EVERY school is out for whats best for THEIR SCHOOL! if that were true, there would be no association and we would all be just a bunch of individual schools playing each other at random. You show too much of your true colors with that statement, bob.If not, why would Talbot back off with his threats (which wont happen) if only 4A and 5A is reunited? You read his attempt to let the LHSAA try to mend itself as backing off. That is, of course, your opinion. It's also opinion that he doesn't have the support to get it passed. That still remains to be seen. Men, you cant have it both ways. You cant say "All for one and one for all" and then turn right around and say, "well, for us and not for yall" Talbot is a minor, VERY minor player in the state legislature. His weakness is, and was, exposed yesterday and in the general sessions. Plus, the Governor will NEVER sign such craziness. Also your opinion.The ONLY thing that is gonna come out of all of this is no matter what is or is not approved is; 1) Bonine will lose his job 2) Everyone will still play football on friday nights, just like the last 3 years.
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Post by btown on Apr 15, 2016 10:20:53 GMT -6
The Principals are the group that voted in the split. WE WILL NEVER GO BACK TO THE OLD WAY OF THINKING. Now, keep this in mind.....What guarantees does the LHSAA have that should this new "plan" be voted in, there STILL wont be Legislative intervention? (not that I think Talbot has the support, because he doesnt) I have found that the simplest answer is the usually the best...........and here it is. Talbot represents the John Curtis School area. I assume probably most or at least some of the Catholic schools in NOLA also. With this in mind, this "new plan" has been proposed that effectively puts 4A and 5A back together. This allows more playoff teams and more teams for the Catholic Schools (and Curtis) to play. That has been those schools concern, and only concern, from the get.....and rightfully so. With that in mind, all this rhetoric over and over about "For the good of the Association" is a bunch of crap. EVERY school is out for whats best for THEIR SCHOOL! If not, why would Talbot back off with his threats (which wont happen) if only 4A and 5A is reunited? Men, you cant have it both ways. You cant say "All for one and one for all" and then turn right around and say, "well, for us and not for yall" Talbot is a minor, VERY minor player in the state legislature. His weakness is, and was, exposed yesterday and in the general sessions. Plus, the Governor will NEVER sign such craziness. The ONLY thing that is gonna come out of all of this is no matter what is or is not approved is; 1) Bonine will lose his job 2) Everyone will still play football on friday nights, just like the last 3 years. I understand what you are saying. But if everyone would leave the LHSAA principals alone they could then work to improve the system we have. But every year or every six months it is fight just to keep what they voted, no time to start looking to the futrue to improve the system. I think everyone agrees the system can be improved on but when do they have time when it is always a fight.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 10:45:18 GMT -6
The Principals are the group that voted in the split. WE WILL NEVER GO BACK TO THE OLD WAY OF THINKING. And no one is suggesting that. That's only in your own mind. But by all means keep using that caps lock button. It's truly intimidating.
Now, keep this in mind.....What guarantees does the LHSAA have that should this new "plan" be voted in, there STILL wont be Legislative intervention? (not that I think Talbot has the support, because he doesnt) I have found that the simplest answer is the usually the best...........and here it is. Talbot represents the John Curtis School area. I assume probably most or at least some of the Catholic schools in NOLA also. With this in mind, this "new plan" has been proposed that effectively puts 4A and 5A back together. This allows more playoff teams and more teams for the Catholic Schools (and Curtis) to play. That has been those schools concern, and only concern, from the get.....and rightfully so. With that in mind, all this rhetoric over and over about "For the good of the Association" is a bunch of crap. EVERY school is out for whats best for THEIR SCHOOL! if that were true, there would be no association and we would all be just a bunch of individual schools playing each other at random. You show too much of your true colors with that statement, bob.If not, why would Talbot back off with his threats (which wont happen) if only 4A and 5A is reunited? You read his attempt to let the LHSAA try to mend itself as backing off. That is, of course, your opinion. It's also opinion that he doesn't have the support to get it passed. That still remains to be seen. Men, you cant have it both ways. You cant say "All for one and one for all" and then turn right around and say, "well, for us and not for yall" Talbot is a minor, VERY minor player in the state legislature. His weakness is, and was, exposed yesterday and in the general sessions. Plus, the Governor will NEVER sign such craziness. Also your opinion.The ONLY thing that is gonna come out of all of this is no matter what is or is not approved is; 1) Bonine will lose his job 2) Everyone will still play football on friday nights, just like the last 3 years. My friend, yours is all opinion as well. Difference being, mine is factually based and expereinced. Keep beating your drum (or whatever else you deem necessary) Facts scare people. Scared aint ya!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 10:48:36 GMT -6
The Principals are the group that voted in the split. WE WILL NEVER GO BACK TO THE OLD WAY OF THINKING. Now, keep this in mind.....What guarantees does the LHSAA have that should this new "plan" be voted in, there STILL wont be Legislative intervention? (not that I think Talbot has the support, because he doesnt) I have found that the simplest answer is the usually the best...........and here it is. Talbot represents the John Curtis School area. I assume probably most or at least some of the Catholic schools in NOLA also. With this in mind, this "new plan" has been proposed that effectively puts 4A and 5A back together. This allows more playoff teams and more teams for the Catholic Schools (and Curtis) to play. That has been those schools concern, and only concern, from the get.....and rightfully so. With that in mind, all this rhetoric over and over about "For the good of the Association" is a bunch of crap. EVERY school is out for whats best for THEIR SCHOOL! If not, why would Talbot back off with his threats (which wont happen) if only 4A and 5A is reunited? Men, you cant have it both ways. You cant say "All for one and one for all" and then turn right around and say, "well, for us and not for yall" Talbot is a minor, VERY minor player in the state legislature. His weakness is, and was, exposed yesterday and in the general sessions. Plus, the Governor will NEVER sign such craziness. The ONLY thing that is gonna come out of all of this is no matter what is or is not approved is; 1) Bonine will lose his job 2) Everyone will still play football on friday nights, just like the last 3 years. I understand what you are saying. But if everyone would leave the LHSAA principals alone they could then work to improve the system we have. But every year or every six months it is fight just to keep what they voted, no time to start looking to the futrue to improve the system. I think everyone agrees the system can be improved on but when do they have time when it is always a fight. I see your point. If the Legislature and the Media would just stay out of the way, the organization could be improved, I agree. However, quite frankly, I dont know how mucy more "tweaking" can be done. The bottom line is, educational choices in our state are VERY diverse. There is really only two, logical, options. 1) Do nothing and everyone play everyone. Basically what we've been doing, but times, oh they have changed since 1970 2) Seperate and classify along the lines of how schools attain, deny, and keep enrollment..............the current system. Anything less than either of those two, is nothing more than an IRS type, 9000000 page rulebook mess.
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Post by btown on Apr 15, 2016 10:58:41 GMT -6
I understand what you are saying. But if everyone would leave the LHSAA principals alone they could then work to improve the system we have. But every year or every six months it is fight just to keep what they voted, no time to start looking to the futrue to improve the system. I think everyone agrees the system can be improved on but when do they have time when it is always a fight. I see your point. If the Legislature and the Media would just stay out of the way, the organization could be improved, I agree. However, quite frankly, I dont know how mucy more "tweaking" can be done. The bottom line is, educational choices in our state are VERY diverse. There is really only two, logical, options. 1) Do nothing and everyone play everyone. Basically what we've been doing, but times, oh they have changed since 1970 2) Seperate and classify along the lines of how schools attain, deny, and keep enrollment..............the current system. Anything less than either of those two, is nothing more than an IRS type, 9000000 page rulebook mess. My improvement is to figure out how to make all brackets 16 teams. Then for sure no one is getting more than the other.
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Post by pinion on Apr 15, 2016 11:17:00 GMT -6
I repeat, we will never "go back together", not like it was. Apples and Oranges. The non select schools will never again put themselves at such a competitive disadvantage JUST to appease schools/parents that choose to send their kids elsewhere. That ship has sailed There is no competitive disadvantage. That's all 100% in your head. There is, however, a competitive disadvantage, that the public schools bring on themselves by their unwillingness to open enrollment up to whomever. I'd be happy if the public schools would just say "we caused this and we're punishing private schools for our own stupidity".
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Post by pinion on Apr 15, 2016 11:19:43 GMT -6
I didn't say it would go back to how it was before. I fully agree there should be a method put in place to adjust a school's enrollment numbers up or down to put them in classifications with other schools that they are better able to compete with. However, there is no reason we can't go back to 5 football classes with ALL teams eligible to make the playoffs in their respective class. You might not see a reason why we can't go back to 5 football classes in the playoffs, but the principals do. As long as different groups keep trying to force the issue it will never happen. The principals keep getting backed into a corner, by Bonine or the Legislators, and they do not like. If everyone would leave it alone the principals could work towards improving the system, but have never been given a chance. Would the system get better over night, no. The principals? I don't know how much of that I buy. I know in Caddo, the principals did what the CPSB Super told them to do with only a couple of exceptions.
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 11:34:13 GMT -6
My friend, yours is all opinion as well. Difference being, mine is factually based and expereinced. Keep beating your drum (or whatever else you deem necessary) Facts scare people. Scared aint ya! Literally quaking in my boots. The difference bob, is that I don't try to claim that my opinions are fact. You make statements that are pure conjecture, some that are simply wrong and try to pass them off as factually based. It would be laughable if it were not so sad. You haven't stated a single fact since you've been posting on this board other than that there will still be football on friday nights. Such an astute observation... You're like Nostradamus or something. Keep up the good work.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 11:54:48 GMT -6
You might not see a reason why we can't go back to 5 football classes in the playoffs, but the principals do. As long as different groups keep trying to force the issue it will never happen. The principals keep getting backed into a corner, by Bonine or the Legislators, and they do not like. If everyone would leave it alone the principals could work towards improving the system, but have never been given a chance. Would the system get better over night, no. The principals? I don't know how much of that I buy. I know in Caddo, the principals did what the CPSB Super told them to do with only a couple of exceptions. This is 100% false. You have been lied to if someone told you this.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 12:17:51 GMT -6
My friend, yours is all opinion as well. Difference being, mine is factually based and expereinced. Keep beating your drum (or whatever else you deem necessary) Facts scare people. Scared aint ya! Literally quaking in my boots. The difference bob, is that I don't try to claim that my opinions are fact. You make statements that are pure conjecture, some that are simply wrong and try to pass them off as factually based. It would be laughable if it were not so sad. You haven't stated a single fact since you've been posting on this board other than that there will still be football on friday nights. Such an astute observation... You're like Nostradamus or something. Keep up the good work. Because you dont know the facts (due to limited experience) doesnt change the fact, that they are facts. If you think that there is no competitive advantage between select enrollment and non select enrollment, then not only are you completely wrong, you are also in the minority in over 30 states. But, thats probably about right..............(the you being in the minority part)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 12:21:37 GMT -6
Just google "public vs private high school athletics". Countless hundreds of case studies, examples, state experiments pop up. The world is not flat my friend. You are not THAT dumb. You are, like the rest of us, simply stating what best helps your school. Your concern is your school, like many in the catholic sector, are not allowed to use the advantage to its utmost capabilities. All the while, how many different public school zones, parishes, etc.....do you guys get your student enrollment?
Must be poor coaching.
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Post by chalmetteowl on Apr 15, 2016 12:29:08 GMT -6
Literally quaking in my boots. The difference bob, is that I don't try to claim that my opinions are fact. You make statements that are pure conjecture, some that are simply wrong and try to pass them off as factually based. It would be laughable if it were not so sad. You haven't stated a single fact since you've been posting on this board other than that there will still be football on friday nights. Such an astute observation... You're like Nostradamus or something. Keep up the good work. Because you dont know the facts (due to limited experience) doesnt change the fact, that they are facts. If you think that there is no competitive advantage between select enrollment and non select enrollment, then not only are you completely wrong, you are also in the minority in over 30 states. But, thats probably about right..............(the you being in the minority part) Let's be honest, the competitive advantage exists, but the real question I have is how significant is it? Enough that the "unfair" description is deserved? Probably not. I just want to see close games
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 12:32:42 GMT -6
Because you dont know the facts (due to limited experience) doesnt change the fact, that they are facts. If you think that there is no competitive advantage between select enrollment and non select enrollment, then not only are you completely wrong, you are also in the minority in over 30 states. But, thats probably about right..............(the you being in the minority part) Let's be honest, the competitive advantage exists, but the real question I have is how significant is it? Enough that the "unfair" description is deserved? Probably not. I just want to see close games To clarify, the competitive advantage only exists in schools that actually use it. Schools that do not use, have no advantage.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 12:45:34 GMT -6
Let's be honest, the competitive advantage exists, but the real question I have is how significant is it? Enough that the "unfair" description is deserved? Probably not. I just want to see close games To clarify, the competitive advantage only exists in schools that actually use it. Schools that do not use, have no advantage. Incorrect, the schools that choose not to use it still have competitive advantage. They can use it at their descretion. Schools that dont have it, can never use it. I have a competitive advantage if Im in a Corvette and you're in a Geo. Anytime I want to step on the gas I can. The ball is in my court to win easily.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 12:47:48 GMT -6
Because you dont know the facts (due to limited experience) doesnt change the fact, that they are facts. If you think that there is no competitive advantage between select enrollment and non select enrollment, then not only are you completely wrong, you are also in the minority in over 30 states. But, thats probably about right..............(the you being in the minority part) Let's be honest, the competitive advantage exists, but the real question I have is how significant is it? Enough that the "unfair" description is deserved? Probably not. I just want to see close games I agree to a point. It is MUCH harder to have a significant advantage in larger schools. Sheer numbers dictate the loss of percentiles of advantage gained. However, such advantage still exist. As you get into smaller and smaller schools, the advantage grows more and more, culminating in those schools that choose to manipulate classification by denying addmittance.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2016 12:51:04 GMT -6
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Post by btown on Apr 15, 2016 13:06:51 GMT -6
Let's be honest, the competitive advantage exists, but the real question I have is how significant is it? Enough that the "unfair" description is deserved? Probably not. I just want to see close games To clarify, the competitive advantage only exists in schools that actually use it. Schools that do not use, have no advantage. That is the big question, how do you seperate the private schools that use the advantage from the ones that do not us the advantage? Solve that problem then there will be no problem.
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Post by Raven on Apr 15, 2016 13:14:00 GMT -6
To clarify, the competitive advantage only exists in schools that actually use it. Schools that do not use, have no advantage. That is the big question, how do you seperate the private schools that use the advantage from the ones that do not us the advantage? Solve that problem then there will be no problem. Wholeheartedly agree. This is what the school relations committee should be working on.
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