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Post by deadman318 on May 10, 2016 11:08:53 GMT -6
LHSAA Members Need to Read Their Constitution Post on: May 4, 2016 104.5 ESPN
The Constitution of the LHSAA states in Article 2.1.5 “their purpose is to preserve the game for the boys and girls and not sacrifice the boys and girls to the game.” Article 2.3” The Association is vitally interested in the welfare of every boy and girl participating in athletic contests. It is for the protection of their interests that the Association operates.” If a proposal is going to be presented, shouldn’t it follow that particular Association’s Constitution? It is arguable that these “split” proposals by the LHSAA principal’s DO NOT take EVERY boy and girl into consideration!
First with football and I’m going to use Many High School as an example. Three years prior to the split (2010-2012), Many was a 21 seed and beat 12 seed Menard (select), a 12 seed and lost to 21 seed Homer (non-select) and a 32nd seed losing to 1 seed John Curtis (select). Post-split (2013-2015), Many has been the #1 seed all three years defeating their opponents by a combined score of 177-7; those 3 schools have a combined record of 3-29. Did they improve that much overnight or did the quality of competition get weaker? Maybe these numbers will help. In football Class 2A from 2010-2012 only 12 teams made the playoffs with losing records with the worst record being 3-7 twice. Same class, from 2013-2015 a total of 54 teams made the playoffs with losing records; seven teams won 2 games, 12 teams won 1 and 2 teams did not win a game.
Moving to the most recent proposal from Many’s Principal to split basketball, softball and baseball; it’s doable but, like football, at the expense of sacrificing the boys and girls to the game. Under the current LHSAA classification guidelines, in classes 5A-1A, 13 teams in girls basketball and 15 teams in boys basketball made the playoffs this past season with losing records. Bookers new proposal, if in place this year, would allow 87 teams in girls basketball and 80 teams in boys basketball to enter the playoffs with losing records. Softball would have increased from 31 to 70; baseball 24 to 60. This proposal would increase the number of losing teams in the playoffs from 83 to 297! Is this preserving the game?
Athletic competition teaches kids how to give effort, have discipline, keep a positive attitude, stay persistent and overcome adversity. When kids realize life isn’t fair they will have these particular values to fall back on to achieve success. Will a championship or trophy determine whether a boy or girl gets a job or not? Absolutely not, but what they learn while trying to achieve that championship certainly will.
By: Todd Black
Follow @louisianaprep
Follow @coachblackespn
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Post by deadman318 on May 10, 2016 11:09:28 GMT -6
If this has already been talked about I apologize...
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Post by btown on May 10, 2016 11:37:02 GMT -6
LHSAA Members Need to Read Their Constitution Post on: May 4, 2016 104.5 ESPN The Constitution of the LHSAA states in Article 2.1.5 “their purpose is to preserve the game for the boys and girls and not sacrifice the boys and girls to the game.” Article 2.3” The Association is vitally interested in the welfare of every boy and girl participating in athletic contests. It is for the protection of their interests that the Association operates.” If a proposal is going to be presented, shouldn’t it follow that particular Association’s Constitution? It is arguable that these “split” proposals by the LHSAA principal’s DO NOT take EVERY boy and girl into consideration! First with football and I’m going to use Many High School as an example. Three years prior to the split (2010-2012), Many was a 21 seed and beat 12 seed Menard (select), a 12 seed and lost to 21 seed Homer (non-select) and a 32nd seed losing to 1 seed John Curtis (select). Post-split (2013-2015), Many has been the #1 seed all three years defeating their opponents by a combined score of 177-7; those 3 schools have a combined record of 3-29. Did they improve that much overnight or did the quality of competition get weaker? Maybe these numbers will help. In football Class 2A from 2010-2012 only 12 teams made the playoffs with losing records with the worst record being 3-7 twice. Same class, from 2013-2015 a total of 54 teams made the playoffs with losing records; seven teams won 2 games, 12 teams won 1 and 2 teams did not win a game. Moving to the most recent proposal from Many’s Principal to split basketball, softball and baseball; it’s doable but, like football, at the expense of sacrificing the boys and girls to the game. Under the current LHSAA classification guidelines, in classes 5A-1A, 13 teams in girls basketball and 15 teams in boys basketball made the playoffs this past season with losing records. Bookers new proposal, if in place this year, would allow 87 teams in girls basketball and 80 teams in boys basketball to enter the playoffs with losing records. Softball would have increased from 31 to 70; baseball 24 to 60. This proposal would increase the number of losing teams in the playoffs from 83 to 297! Is this preserving the game? Athletic competition teaches kids how to give effort, have discipline, keep a positive attitude, stay persistent and overcome adversity. When kids realize life isn’t fair they will have these particular values to fall back on to achieve success. Will a championship or trophy determine whether a boy or girl gets a job or not? Absolutely not, but what they learn while trying to achieve that championship certainly will. By: Todd Black Follow @louisianaprep Follow @coachblackespn So what would happen if they drop brackets to 16 teams?
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Post by deadman318 on May 10, 2016 11:45:33 GMT -6
No idea... All I can tell you is that Many's success is dictated by the weaker playoff schedule... At least that is what I got out of the article...
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Post by indy on May 10, 2016 12:06:14 GMT -6
LHSAA Members Need to Read Their Constitution Post on: May 4, 2016 104.5 ESPN The Constitution of the LHSAA states in Article 2.1.5 “their purpose is to preserve the game for the boys and girls and not sacrifice the boys and girls to the game.” Article 2.3” The Association is vitally interested in the welfare of every boy and girl participating in athletic contests. It is for the protection of their interests that the Association operates.” If a proposal is going to be presented, shouldn’t it follow that particular Association’s Constitution? It is arguable that these “split” proposals by the LHSAA principal’s DO NOT take EVERY boy and girl into consideration! First with football and I’m going to use Many High School as an example. Three years prior to the split (2010-2012), Many was a 21 seed and beat 12 seed Menard (select), a 12 seed and lost to 21 seed Homer (non-select) and a 32nd seed losing to 1 seed John Curtis (select). Post-split (2013-2015), Many has been the #1 seed all three years defeating their opponents by a combined score of 177-7; those 3 schools have a combined record of 3-29. Did they improve that much overnight or did the quality of competition get weaker? Maybe these numbers will help. In football Class 2A from 2010-2012 only 12 teams made the playoffs with losing records with the worst record being 3-7 twice. Same class, from 2013-2015 a total of 54 teams made the playoffs with losing records; seven teams won 2 games, 12 teams won 1 and 2 teams did not win a game. Moving to the most recent proposal from Many’s Principal to split basketball, softball and baseball; it’s doable but, like football, at the expense of sacrificing the boys and girls to the game. Under the current LHSAA classification guidelines, in classes 5A-1A, 13 teams in girls basketball and 15 teams in boys basketball made the playoffs this past season with losing records. Bookers new proposal, if in place this year, would allow 87 teams in girls basketball and 80 teams in boys basketball to enter the playoffs with losing records. Softball would have increased from 31 to 70; baseball 24 to 60. This proposal would increase the number of losing teams in the playoffs from 83 to 297! Is this preserving the game? Athletic competition teaches kids how to give effort, have discipline, keep a positive attitude, stay persistent and overcome adversity. When kids realize life isn’t fair they will have these particular values to fall back on to achieve success. Will a championship or trophy determine whether a boy or girl gets a job or not? Absolutely not, but what they learn while trying to achieve that championship certainly will. By: Todd Black Follow @louisianaprep Follow @coachblackespn So what would happen if they drop brackets to 16 teams? 16 team brackets eliminates one round of watered down playoffs. Da !
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Post by Brad on May 11, 2016 6:01:14 GMT -6
Its possible Many just had a good couple classes go through...it happens in HS. 3 years probably isn't enough data to make an assumption. But it doesn't look good does it?
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Post by btown on May 11, 2016 6:34:07 GMT -6
So what would happen if they drop brackets to 16 teams? 16 team brackets eliminates one round of watered down playoffs. Da ! So you are saying all of the non select bracket is watered down? Because your statement implies that all of the non select playoffs is watered down.
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Post by indy on May 11, 2016 6:39:53 GMT -6
16 team brackets eliminates one round of watered down playoffs. Da ! So you are saying all of the non select bracket is watered down? Because your statement implies that all of the non select playoffs is watered down. It is extremely watered down, I think that is obvious and not an opinion.
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Post by btown on May 11, 2016 7:03:13 GMT -6
So you are saying all of the non select bracket is watered down? Because your statement implies that all of the non select playoffs is watered down. It is extremely watered down, I think that is obvious and not an opinion. So why does the select side want to play teams that are watered down on the non select side. Ok that's right the select side wants to have those watered down teams in the playoffs so that they(private schools) can go deeper into the playoffs. Not good for business for private schools to be out of playoffs in second round that is why the want the public schools around, to send them home in the second round.
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Post by indy on May 11, 2016 7:12:23 GMT -6
It is extremely watered down, I think that is obvious and not an opinion. So why does the select side want to play teams that are watered down on the non select side. Ok that's right the select side wants to have those watered down teams in the playoffs so that they(private schools) can go deeper into the playoffs. Not good for business for private schools to be out of playoffs in second round that is why the want the public schools around, to send them home in the second round. Thats a whole different topic. The fact is when you remove 1/3 of the schools and don't reduce the championships it is watered down. So is the private side but not by our choice. We want to compete with all schools and produce a true champion.
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Post by publicgradprivatedad on May 11, 2016 7:13:59 GMT -6
I don't think either side is completely watered down. I do feel that if you only won 0,1,2 games you shouldn't be in the playoffs. If the "non-select" bracket is dropped to 16 teams as some of the split supporters have said, like the "select bracket" why not combine them back into a 32 team bracket?
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Post by publicgradprivatedad on May 11, 2016 7:16:07 GMT -6
It is extremely watered down, I think that is obvious and not an opinion. So why does the select side want to play teams that are watered down on the non select side. Ok that's right the select side wants to have those watered down teams in the playoffs so that they(private schools) can go deeper into the playoffs. Not good for business for private schools to be out of playoffs in second round that is why the want the public schools around, to send them home in the second round. I don't think it would be playing "those watered down teams", you would have the top 16 "non-select" playing against the top 16 "select". How is that watered down or not the best playing the best by anyone's definition?
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Post by iknownuthing on May 11, 2016 8:14:46 GMT -6
So why does the select side want to play teams that are watered down on the non select side. Ok that's right the select side wants to have those watered down teams in the playoffs so that they(private schools) can go deeper into the playoffs. Not good for business for private schools to be out of playoffs in second round that is why the want the public schools around, to send them home in the second round. I don't think it would be playing "those watered down teams", you would have the top 16 "non-select" playing against the top 16 "select". How is that watered down or not the best playing the best by anyone's definition? While I support moving to 16 teams for all sports playoffs, that idea will NEVER be considered and as such is nothing more than a Red Herring. Too many principals and coaches want to put it on their resumes that their school went to the playoffs in x out of XX years. So what you are left with is a Non-select segment with a very large number of schools making the playoffs and the kids get to put a patch on their Letterman jacket that they stop wearing once they graduate. The principal gets to put a plaque on the wall with another addition to his playoff success, even though no one mentions that in that playoff appearance they lost 64-0. I will state that the classification with the least impact on the playoffs quality has been 5A. When the split originally was setup, there were only 9 or 10 Select schools in that class. STM and Teurlings moved up to help try to make it work as did JC and e.
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 8:26:43 GMT -6
So why does the select side want to play teams that are watered down on the non select side. Ok that's right the select side wants to have those watered down teams in the playoffs so that they(private schools) can go deeper into the playoffs. Not good for business for private schools to be out of playoffs in second round that is why the want the public schools around, to send them home in the second round. Thats a whole different topic. The fact is when you remove 1/3 of the schools and don't reduce the championships it is watered down. So is the private side but not by our choice. We want to compete with all schools and produce a true champion. DIV III could be argued as the best competitive select bracket... Any of the top 4-6 could win it...
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Post by iknownuthing on May 11, 2016 8:42:37 GMT -6
Thats a whole different topic. The fact is when you remove 1/3 of the schools and don't reduce the championships it is watered down. So is the private side but not by our choice. We want to compete with all schools and produce a true champion. DIV III could be argued as the best competitive select bracket... Any of the top 4-6 could win it... Absolutely, While the public "Champions" were pounding out state championships by an average of 24 PPG over their public brethren, the Private schools games were fantastic and competitive down right exciting across the board, well except Division IV.
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 8:52:33 GMT -6
DIV III could be argued as the best competitive select bracket... Any of the top 4-6 could win it... Absolutely, While the public "Champions" were pounding out state championships by an average of 24 PPG over their public brethren, the Private schools games were fantastic and competitive down right exciting across the board, well except Division IV. Div IV is downright horrible. I heard that Calvary may have to move down to 1A (of course its Div IV) because of declining enrollment... They will have virtually no competition. No disrespect to anyone in Div IV...
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Post by iknownuthing on May 11, 2016 9:47:22 GMT -6
Absolutely, While the public "Champions" were pounding out state championships by an average of 24 PPG over their public brethren, the Private schools games were fantastic and competitive down right exciting across the board, well except Division IV. Div IV is downright horrible. I heard that Calvary may have to move down to 1A (of course its Div IV) because of declining enrollment... They will have virtually no competition. No disrespect to anyone in Div IV... Most Div IV private schools would be class C schools if they did not offer football. A few B that is why. Time for Calvary to step up and play with the big boys rather than drop down to a lower class. They can compete.
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 10:26:19 GMT -6
Div IV is downright horrible. I heard that Calvary may have to move down to 1A (of course its Div IV) because of declining enrollment... They will have virtually no competition. No disrespect to anyone in Div IV... Most Div IV private schools would be class C schools if they did not offer football. A few B that is why. Time for Calvary to step up and play with the big boys rather than drop down to a lower class. They can compete. Calvary doesn't have the numbers to support your statement. They don't have over 60 players on the football team...
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 10:28:14 GMT -6
It's really easy to make that statement when you HAVE numbers...
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Post by publicgradprivatedad on May 11, 2016 10:37:48 GMT -6
Most Div IV private schools would be class C schools if they did not offer football. A few B that is why. Time for Calvary to step up and play with the big boys rather than drop down to a lower class. They can compete. Calvary doesn't have the numbers to support your statement. They don't have over 60 players on the football team... They will have the option of moving down to Div IV (if this is where their enrollment is), stay in Div III, or even move up to Div II or Div I. I think he was saying why move to Div IV and have a easy go of it when you can compete where you are currently or moving up to a higher Division.
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Post by iknownuthing on May 11, 2016 10:46:35 GMT -6
It's really easy to make that statement when you HAVE numbers... Nah, you guys should be playing in at least Division III if not Div II. You guys have played both STM and Teurlings in the past.
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 10:48:27 GMT -6
Numbers is the key here... Calvary has a brutal first 5 games... Teurlings Catholic, Byrd, and Zachary are in the first 5 games, not to mention Peabody and Union Parish are not chumps by ANY stretch of the imagination... Attrition is going to catch up with them... Maybe/Maybe Not... I don't think they allow you to move up in playoff bracket... I do believe you play where you play in district. If they are in 1A then they have to play in Div IV. Of course, I may be wrong...
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Post by publicgradprivatedad on May 11, 2016 10:54:07 GMT -6
You can play up, you will have to play in a district that coincides with the Division for the playoffs. Div IV---1A, Div III---2A, Div II--3A & 4A, Div I--5A. You just have to decide by a certain date if you are playing up or staying in your enrollment class/division.
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 11:00:42 GMT -6
I'm here to tell ya... My source is pretty reliable... They just don't have the numbers... Teams like Teurlings, STM, and Notre Dame have over 100 man rosters...
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Post by publicgradprivatedad on May 11, 2016 11:19:37 GMT -6
I'm here to tell ya... My source is pretty reliable... They just don't have the numbers... Teams like Teurlings, STM, and Notre Dame have over 100 man rosters... Not questioning you...I was just explaining that Calvary will have a decision to make. They can play to their enrollment (wherever that is) or they can play up to a different class/division).
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Post by indy on May 11, 2016 11:23:38 GMT -6
I'm here to tell ya... My source is pretty reliable... They just don't have the numbers... Teams like Teurlings, STM, and Notre Dame have over 100 man rosters... I heard Coach Bachman tell coach Cook prior to our game that he was going to play up to 4a after this year. Doing it for competition but mainly for the bigger gate
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 11:32:14 GMT -6
I'm here to tell ya... My source is pretty reliable... They just don't have the numbers... Teams like Teurlings, STM, and Notre Dame have over 100 man rosters... I heard Coach Bachman tell coach Cook prior to our game that he was going to play up to 4a after this year. Doing it for competition but mainly for the bigger gate Declining Numbers may be the trump card... It is what it is...
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2016 11:38:55 GMT -6
I'm here to tell ya... My source is pretty reliable... They just don't have the numbers... Teams like Teurlings, STM, and Notre Dame have over 100 man rosters... I heard Coach Bachman tell coach Cook prior to our game that he was going to play up to 4a after this year. Doing it for competition but mainly for the bigger gate He told me the same thing. Going up to 4A ASAP.
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Post by deadman318 on May 11, 2016 11:51:29 GMT -6
When it doesn't happen I'll be the first to say I told ya so... You do realize that its not Bachman's decision, right?
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Post by indy on May 11, 2016 12:09:29 GMT -6
When it doesn't happen I'll be the first to say I told ya so... You do realize that its not Bachman's decision, right? Simply repeating what he said.
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