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Post by rvanicor on Apr 5, 2017 11:32:19 GMT -6
Don't understand how on earth this is working. Is 2a Many last week was 17-6 ranked 8th with 13 of those wins coming against class 1a 4 wins, B 8 wins and C 1 win and they lost this week to make them 17-7 and they moved up 4 spots to number 4 ranking. Vinton has played no 5a, 4a teams and only has quality wins against Iowa 13-9 and Mamou 3-2 and two other wins against 1a Grandlake. Vinton has lost to kinder, Dequincy and welsh 3 out of last 4 games yet is still ranked ahead of kinder and welsh two teams who have faced touch schedules. This ranking system is horrible. Look at opponent win loss records not only that pull up who these two teams they have beat. Makes no sense. Is 2a public Sterlington, lakeside, French settlement, Mangham, kinder, Dequincy and welsh are top 10! The calculations for this formula need to be changed. So a team can play all class b and c schools and run rule them like they should then go 3-7 or 2-8 or 4-6 in district and stay top 10 that's bull. Change is needed
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Post by dogwalk on Apr 5, 2017 11:53:14 GMT -6
Don't understand how on earth this is working. Is 2a Many last week was 17-6 ranked 8th with 13 of those wins coming against class 1a 4 wins, B 8 wins and C 1 win and they lost this week to make them 17-7 and they moved up 4 spots to number 4 ranking. Vinton has played no 5a, 4a teams and only has quality wins against Iowa 13-9 and Mamou 3-2 and two other wins against 1a Grandlake. Vinton has lost to kinder, Dequincy and welsh 3 out of last 4 games yet is still ranked ahead of kinder and welsh two teams who have faced touch schedules. This ranking system is horrible. Look at opponent win loss records not only that pull up who these two teams they have beat. Makes no sense. Is 2a public Sterlington, lakeside, French settlement, Mangham, kinder, Dequincy and welsh are top 10! The calculations for this formula need to be changed. So a team can play all class b and c schools and run rule them like they should then go 3-7 or 2-8 or 4-6 in district and stay top 10 that's bull. Change is needed Be careful, I brought up that argument a few years back...using Many as an example (because they played such a weak schedule that season)..the baseball gods decided to pair us in the second round that year...we got 10 run ruled by Many, we were a 7 seed that year. Just play the game, let the rankings play out, and beat the teams you are paired with in the playoffs. |
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Post by rvanicor on Apr 5, 2017 12:13:52 GMT -6
I am a calculator when it comes to this sport on percentages , stats, and formulas. No extra points for quality wins? Every team has a stud everyone is vulnerable the first couple playoff games. This is why it is more important to get true accurate power rankings. Everyone has a stud pitcher and it's different then football you are putting 9 on the field not 22 so the 9 will be most of the time able to match up easier then 22. There is a team that has 5 wins against the same class b school how is that logical reason to rank them high because they 5-0 at begging of season. All I am saying
It needs a new formula. I am not picking on any kids, coaches or schools it's the way the formula is is what the problem is. So if the formula lets you play down to lowest class and go 17-0 them lose 6 district games and stay too 10 then hey jump aboard coaches and get that home playoff game but that sometimes does not have you playoff ready but remember everyone has at least one stud pitcher so first two rounds everyone is vulnerable
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Post by dogwalk on Apr 5, 2017 12:26:01 GMT -6
I get what your saying, but I don't think there is any point system that could be implemented in highschool where you could classify teams as "quality opponents". Teams already receive extra points for playing up in class. If a coach thinks its more important to get wins than to prepare his team by playing a tougher schedule, then that should be his prerogative. The 2 out of 3 series will not allow one team to ride their stud arm all the way to the tournament. I am also under the firm belief that if you can't win a one gamer in the first round...then you aren't good enough to win the whole thing.
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Post by doublej on Apr 5, 2017 16:04:12 GMT -6
A lot of teams play who they do because those teams will come to their tournament. Not every school can charge $500 to $1000 to players just to be on the team. The only money maker is their tournament. In the end you play who is on your schedule and it all works out in the end.
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Post by fridaynights on Apr 5, 2017 18:58:39 GMT -6
Many has a better record and the teams they have beaten has a better record than the teams welsh has beaten. Many's oponents wins loss record is 195-79 and Welshs is 122-120.
Many is the better team ask Florien who played both of us. Many hammered them at Florien with their ace on the mound 19-0 welsh squeaked by in a come from behind win.
Let's just hope the baseball gods put you guys in our bracket in a couple weeks.
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Post by OICU812 on Apr 5, 2017 20:18:02 GMT -6
Don't understand how on earth this is working. Is 2a Many last week was 17-6 ranked 8th with 13 of those wins coming against class 1a 4 wins, B 8 wins and C 1 win and they lost this week to make them 17-7 and they moved up 4 spots to number 4 ranking. Vinton has played no 5a, 4a teams and only has quality wins against Iowa 13-9 and Mamou 3-2 and two other wins against 1a Grandlake. Vinton has lost to kinder, Dequincy and welsh 3 out of last 4 games yet is still ranked ahead of kinder and welsh two teams who have faced touch schedules. This ranking system is horrible. Look at opponent win loss records not only that pull up who these two teams they have beat. Makes no sense. Is 2a public Sterlington, lakeside, French settlement, Mangham, kinder, Dequincy and welsh are top 10! The calculations for this formula need to be changed. So a team can play all class b and c schools and run rule them like they should then go 3-7 or 2-8 or 4-6 in district and stay top 10 that's bull. Change is needed Many was never ranked 8th....there was a glitch, read the other post....and you CAN remain ranked high if you play quality lower class as Many does. |
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Post by rvanicor on Apr 5, 2017 21:10:48 GMT -6
13 wins versus class A and lower is what I was pointing out. I also doubt the Florine ace pitched the whole game with score that bad. When welsh played them we also faced him and we threw our #5 because we played 5a Byrd, 5a airline, 4a tioga and Florine so we didn't pitch our best that game. I am not saying many would best welsh or
Welsh would
Beat Many I was saying a better system determining power ranking is needed. Welsh team is young we have not one starting senior , 4 juniors, 5 sopres starting so our best baseball is to come but when you all have a stud any team can be beat. Baseball is so hot and cold. I was saying need more of a better power ranking system and playing a ton of lower class teams below your classification counts as a win but quality wins and other power pints should be awarded when you play up in class and play top 10 teams. Welsh has faced Tioga, deridder, buckeye, Westlake, kinder, Dequincy, Vinton, Grandlake, Florine who is in
Top 10 in their classes. Also a good airline and Byrd team. So over 50 percent of games are against top 10 teams then add airline and Byrd. It's ok come playoff time it will all be settled.
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Post by dogwalk on Apr 6, 2017 7:20:28 GMT -6
13 wins versus class A and lower is what I was pointing out. I also doubt the Florine ace pitched the whole game with score that bad. When welsh played them we also faced him and we threw our #5 because we played 5a Byrd, 5a airline, 4a tioga and Florine so we didn't pitch our best that game. I am not saying many would best welsh or Welsh would Beat Many I was saying a better system determining power ranking is needed. Welsh team is young we have not one starting senior , 4 juniors, 5 sopres starting so our best baseball is to come but when you all have a stud any team can be beat. Baseball is so hot and cold. I was saying need more of a better power ranking system and playing a ton of lower class teams below your classification counts as a win but quality wins and other power pints should be awarded when you play up in class and play top 10 teams. Welsh has faced Tioga, deridder, buckeye, Westlake, kinder, Dequincy, Vinton, Grandlake, Florine who is in Top 10 in their classes. Also a good airline and Byrd team. So over 50 percent of games are against top 10 teams then add airline and Byrd. It's ok come playoff time it will all be settled. There is already a point system reward in place for playing up in classification. A point system reward for top ten teams is not feasible..one because you don't know who the top ten teams are at the start of any given season..two because the top ten may not stay the same throughout the season. If you play a difficult schedule...you have to beat some of those teams for it to reflect in your power rating (high risk-high reward kinda deal). Also, the number A's don't mean a thing...you can either play or you can't...small schools whip big schools all the time. |
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Post by iknownuthing on Apr 7, 2017 11:33:34 GMT -6
A lot of teams play who they do because those teams will come to their tournament. Not every school can charge $500 to $1000 to players just to be on the team. The only money maker is their tournament. In the end you play who is on your schedule and it all works out in the end. Ok, I will bite. Who is charging $500 to $1000 just to be on a high school team? I know of some participation fees, but none that come anywhere near this level. Now select ball, oh yeah, that happens but I want to know which high schools your talking about. |
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Post by doublej on Apr 7, 2017 15:09:48 GMT -6
Ask a Neville or West Ouachita parent how much it costs for their kid to be on the team.
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Post by meangene on Apr 7, 2017 16:23:24 GMT -6
As a WO parent it does not cost us anything to play...cant speak for all teams I am sure some schools do have a fee
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Post by fridaynights on Apr 7, 2017 18:36:31 GMT -6
That Overated Many team just beat Menard at their place 5-4.
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Post by doublej on Apr 7, 2017 19:57:09 GMT -6
As a WO parent it does not cost us anything to play...cant speak for all teams I am sure some schools do have a fee What about al of those team trips ya'll make in the summers? |
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Post by meangene on Apr 7, 2017 20:51:42 GMT -6
We divide the and pay the entry fees, but all fees go to paying that. We pay our own way.....no fee to be on team.... no one is required to be on the team only play if you want to....
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Post by khsyellowjackets94 on Apr 10, 2017 15:06:08 GMT -6
I get what your saying, but I don't think there is any point system that could be implemented in highschool where you could classify teams as "quality opponents". Teams already receive extra points for playing up in class. If a coach thinks its more important to get wins than to prepare his team by playing a tougher schedule, then that should be his prerogative. The 2 out of 3 series will not allow one team to ride their stud arm all the way to the tournament. I am also under the firm belief that if you can't win a one gamer in the first round...then you aren't good enough to win the whole thing. There is no bonus for playing up in baseball. I think there should be because bigger schools are going to have more pitching depth than smaller schools. But a team's schedule strength is factored in to the formula based on your played opponent's combined won-loss record. It's harder to come up with a formula for baseball because everybody doesn't pay the same amount of games. |
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Post by Brad on Apr 10, 2017 15:51:51 GMT -6
You get two points for each class higher in Baseball....Softball does not have play up points.
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Post by dogwalk on Apr 10, 2017 19:12:48 GMT -6
You get two points for each class higher in Baseball....Softball does not have play up points. I knew I was right. |
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Post by fuzzy on Apr 12, 2017 13:37:54 GMT -6
That Overated Many team just beat Menard at their place 5-4. The recipe for power rating success is to schedule lower classification teams that will win 15 games, which is what Many does. Whether that is right or wrong, it works. I see multiple teams ranked high because of scheduling in this manner. Many has played 12 lower class games, the most of any 2A team in our state. |
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Post by khsyellowjackets94 on Apr 13, 2017 0:56:50 GMT -6
You get two points for each class higher in Baseball....Softball does not have play up points. The handbook says no extra points for playing up for baseball too. Unless they changed it for this season. |
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Post by Brad on Apr 13, 2017 7:11:07 GMT -6
They voted to revert to 2016 Formula after the Handbook was published.....
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Post by purpleandbold on Apr 13, 2017 8:56:39 GMT -6
Don't understand how on earth this is working. Is 2a Many last week was 17-6 ranked 8th with 13 of those wins coming against class 1a 4 wins, B 8 wins and C 1 win and they lost this week to make them 17-7 and they moved up 4 spots to number 4 ranking. Vinton has played no 5a, 4a teams and only has quality wins against Iowa 13-9 and Mamou 3-2 and two other wins against 1a Grandlake. Vinton has lost to kinder, Dequincy and welsh 3 out of last 4 games yet is still ranked ahead of kinder and welsh two teams who have faced touch schedules. This ranking system is horrible. Look at opponent win loss records not only that pull up who these two teams they have beat. Makes no sense. Is 2a public Sterlington, lakeside, French settlement, Mangham, kinder, Dequincy and welsh are top 10! The calculations for this formula need to be changed. So a team can play all class b and c schools and run rule them like they should then go 3-7 or 2-8 or 4-6 in district and stay top 10 that's bull. Change is needed It's "working" because the B and C schools that Many is beating are also winning a lot of games. Don't discount the quality of baseball of some of the B and C schools in Louisiana. They play good baseball, and bring a good gate to the ballpark. A good team is a good team, regardless of the class they play in. You get 20 points for a win, 2 pts for playing up for each classification, and a point for every opponent's win. Many is a very good team, and they have beaten some very good teams, earning them a lot of points along the way. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 10:28:22 GMT -6
Don't understand how on earth this is working. Is 2a Many last week was 17-6 ranked 8th with 13 of those wins coming against class 1a 4 wins, B 8 wins and C 1 win and they lost this week to make them 17-7 and they moved up 4 spots to number 4 ranking. Vinton has played no 5a, 4a teams and only has quality wins against Iowa 13-9 and Mamou 3-2 and two other wins against 1a Grandlake. Vinton has lost to kinder, Dequincy and welsh 3 out of last 4 games yet is still ranked ahead of kinder and welsh two teams who have faced touch schedules. This ranking system is horrible. Look at opponent win loss records not only that pull up who these two teams they have beat. Makes no sense. Is 2a public Sterlington, lakeside, French settlement, Mangham, kinder, Dequincy and welsh are top 10! The calculations for this formula need to be changed. So a team can play all class b and c schools and run rule them like they should then go 3-7 or 2-8 or 4-6 in district and stay top 10 that's bull. Change is needed It's "working" because the B and C schools that Many is beating are also winning a lot of games. Don't discount the quality of baseball of some of the B and C schools in Louisiana. They play good baseball, and bring a good gate to the ballpark. A good team is a good team, regardless of the class they play in. You get 20 points for a win, 2 pts for playing up for each classification, and a point for every opponent's win. Many is a very good team, and they have beaten some very good teams, earning them a lot of points along the way. VERY TRUE...bigger doesn't mean better in baseball. |
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Post by Brad on Apr 13, 2017 10:57:03 GMT -6
Beat teams with winning records and you will rise....simple as that. Regardless of class.
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Post by khsyellowjackets94 on Apr 13, 2017 15:52:12 GMT -6
They voted to revert to 2016 Formula after the Handbook was published..... Ah ok. That's good. 5A schools typically have way more depth than a 2A school for example. Especially when it comes to pitching . |
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Post by rvanicor on May 7, 2017 12:23:56 GMT -6
Well any thoughts now?
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Post by indy on May 7, 2017 12:39:25 GMT -6
Yes, 48 teams in 2A make the playoffs. No system will ever be good enough to un-water the playoffs and make everybody happy. So make a good schedule, coach up your team and play. The better teams will ultimately prevail. |
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Post by rvanicor on May 7, 2017 15:39:31 GMT -6
Indy you forgot to add stop recruiting out of town and parish kids
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Post by indy on May 7, 2017 15:48:52 GMT -6
Indy you forgot to add stop recruiting out of town and parish kids I don't want to make the Many and Kinder folks cry on Sunday. |
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Post by fridaynights on May 7, 2017 15:50:37 GMT -6
No, best teams are left. The System worked.
You have to beat good teams with wins to be ranked high.
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